Welcome to the MidAmerica Region's Monthly Congregational



Leaders Conversation series.



I'm Lauren Wyeth, one



of your congregational life consultants



and MidAmerica's Faith Development Specialist.



I'm a white person in my mid fifties



with curly shoulder length, dark blonde hair



and tortoise shell glasses, and I use she or they pronouns.



From October, 2024 through May, 2025,



MidAmerica regional staff will host a monthly congregational



leaders conversation on an emergent issue,



hopeful development or pressing concern



in Unitarian Universalism. Most will be recorded



and available for viewing



after the event as well, like the one you've tuned in for.



Here we are in a time when religious



communities are in flux.



The conversations we're having now will shape the future



of our faith in significant ways.



And so we set out to bring our whole hearts, our open minds,



and our yearning spirits to the task of meeting this moment



and imagining a way forward together.



If you are a lay or professional leader in a UU congregation



or community, be it in the role of clergy, board member,



welcome team, volunteer administrator, youth group advisor,



small group facilitator, religious educator,



or another capacity,



we're glad you've found us.



These conversations are generally held on the second Tuesday



evening of each month, and are facilitated by myself



and the Reverend David Pyle.



Your experience



and perspectives are valuable to the whole body as we face



what is and cast a vision for what may be



equally valuable are your attention



and witness as others



share their experiences and perspectives.



Should you want to join us live for one



of our upcoming conversations, please register



through the MidAmerica webpage at



www.uua.org/midamerica/events.



There's no cost to attend.



Next up you'll learn a bit more about our speakers



and then we'll dive into the conversation.



Thanks for joining us and welcome.



And, um, I get the pleasure of introducing Joy Berry,



and I'm not gonna look directly at the screen



'cause my words are over here, but I'm, I'm looking at you



with my, with my heart.



Right. Joy Berry currently serves as the children



and families faith development specialist in the UUA



Lifespan Faith Engagement Office.



That's a lot of words y'all,



but it just means that they do amazing work



before coming to the UUA Joy served



in several congregations.



And then on the staff at Meadville Lombard Theological



School's Fahs Collective. Her graduate studies



and anthropology and sociology are an important lens



through which she understands human faith development



as are her lived experiences



as a regenerative farmer and mother.



Joy sees the sacred work of religious education



as not only her calling,



but the life long haul, lifelong work



of Unitarian Universalism



and most essential transformative mission



of UU congregations.



Joy Berry.



Hi, y'all. What an intro. No pressure, right?



It's the most important work that we are called to do here



as Unitarian Universalist.



Um, but we're gonna figure out all of that together.



I'm so excited to talk to y'all a little bit today.



Um, and I'm gonna ask Chanel if you can go ahead



and start the slide deck.



We're seeing that Joy. All right.



So today we are gonna be exploring a little bit about



what I call Whole Church RE



and you may also have seen is Whole Church Philosophy



or Whole Church Faith Development.



It all really is encouraging us to think about



how we might meet the moment we're in right now in this sort



of threshold,



and think about how we could do church differently in a way



that both aligns better with our theology and our values,



and also really prepares our hearts



to live in a world and a community, um, more faithfully.



And so I will say, yes, you know my name,



you know where I serve.



And we'll move to the next slide.



How will we embody, challenge,



and lead such a moment in religious education?



So I always start with this reading by Sophia Fahs.



Sophia Lyon Fahs, the religious way is the deep way,



the way that sees what physical eyes alone fail



to see into the heart of every phenomenon.



The religious way is the way



that touches universal relationships that goes high, wide



and deep, the way that expands the feelings of kinship.



How might we help church do this thing



that Sophia Fahs calls the religious way?



Because it sure sounds great.



It sounds almost like the kind of thing you would want



to preserve a space and a time



and a community that is dedicated to doing



in Unitarian Universalism.



For sure. We'll move on to the next slide.



So part of, uh,



what was shared earlier was Connie Goodbread's take on this



Maria Harris quote



of faith development's.



All we do, Unitarian Universalism is all we teach in the



congregation is the curriculum.



If that were really the case, I mean, it's pretty easy



to say, although it was radical in its in its time,



it was very radical to even say that.



But if it were true,



how might we be able to tell it we're true?



If the congregation was truly the curriculum, we might



change the way that we are together in church.



We might change where we engaged in faith development,



how we engage in faith development,



and with whom many of our churches have one way



of telling the story, the curriculum of religious education.



And it's often a very siloed experience, perhaps with kids



in worship once a month



or maybe every Sunday for a few minutes.



And what we're gonna talk about today is not a move to have



everyone all together all the time in



congregational culture.



However, we can take a look at our systems



and at the way we do religious education as opposed



to the way we do all of church.



And we can think carefully about how we might want to move,



what kinds of opportunities we might have



to communicate differently, to connect differently,



and to learn differently together.



Next slide.



So when we start to ask this question,



how shall we do the process of faith development?



How do we make faith happen?



The first question that comes to my mind is,



what are we teaching?



What is this faith?



Some of our Unitarian Universalist



and denominations in our denomination are really



uncomfortable with even that question, with



that phrase, faith development.



But if we are a religious community, it means



that we have theological centering and grounding values.



And in this faith, we have made a decision not



to change our orienting principles and values,



but to name them, we've had an opportunity to name them.



In a way this is sort of like visioning



and missioning in that we have named what it is



that is our job to do



and is our job to be as Unitarian Universalists



with love at the center.



We wanna move in ways that help us be more interdependent,



more generous, more transformational



and more transformed, more justice seeking



and justice making, more pluralistic,



and with more emphasis and success at equity.



All of these values call us towards a way of being



that are of course aspirational.



We've been able to do some of this in our churches,



and in some ways we still could do better.



I would like to imagine a form of religious education,



a form of how we do faith development that is better aligned



with each of these values.



Next slide, please.



So there's a lot here and we're just gonna skim it.



But one thing that we can say is



that faith development theorists have described how we move



through the faith stages



and development a bit like we're on a conveyor belt.



Although certainly we can change and move



and grow and go backwards.



Um, there is a way in which we develop as people of faith.



And you could see those at the top of this yellow line here,



what James Fowler called the times when faith is caught in



early childhood, taught in middle childhood, bought



as a teenager and sought,



and I have described also as fought



in early adulthood and mid adulthood.



If we stop there, we get churches that have a lot



of conflict, that don't have highly covenantal capable,



um, congregants.



And it creates a particular problem for,



a religious education project



that depends upon adult volunteers.



So it's an existential question,



how will we do faith development for our adults so



that we all know how to be Unitarian Universalists



and how we can live into those communal promises



and be covenantal in faith?



One thing that my congregational work indicated to me is



that we had a lot of UUs who



didn't really have the chops of religious education



and faith development to move beyond that stage



where faith is sought and fought.



Because the next stage



that Fowler describes is when faith is covenantal.



He wasn't a UU, but we are, we need



to be able to get folks there.



I've named that. I think one of the things we've missed



is not really with our kids.



I think we're doing a great job with our children



and, and our youth.



But unfortunately we have lots and lots



and lots of adults who have not had 3, 4, 5 solid years



of every Sunday religious education.



How would we attend to



the faith development needs of a whole congregation,



particularly since we depend on religious education,



volunteers who are adults?



How would we change, how would we be changed by



a hope for a faith that was wrought with more collaborative



creation that is able to be worked over



and over again, wrought faith like wrought iron?



Um, and that could strengthen all of us, our whole community



for the Unitarian Universalism that is praying for us



to get there in the future.



One that's steeply rooted in our values. Next slide, please.



I began to look about for models of, how



religious education



or faith development was seen in, in the big picture.



I really liked how the web of youth ministry, um,



that was put out by the UU's,



faith development office in 2017.



It named these domains of



what faith development does for people



and what it's made up of.



And spiritual care, beloved community, justice making,



faith exploration, multi-generational community.



I can't see everything right now, but maybe you can.



These domains shown here on this web



of youth ministry really excited me



because I thought that for the first time we were modeling a



this central, central, a central question



that we often don't pay enough attention to.



What is faith development? How do we make it happen?



This what is pretty cool



because it names some things



that are already central ministries of a church, communities



of communities within a church, pastoral care,



for example, and justice making.



These are all central aims



for not just a religious education program.



So it begs the question, why are these the right areas



for growth, for faith development to grow in



for youth, but not for adults?



Clearly it's for all of us.



And your church might be a little different.



Your your specific domains here might be a little different.



But I like the idea of modeling that.



I started thinking though about how



religious education has this whole host, this array



of really amazing practices.



And part of the reason they're so cool is



because we have had the siloing that we've had



for a long time in Unitarian Universalism



and in religious education spaces, by which I mean children,



youth, sometimes families.



We have excelled in a sort of specialized



approach to religious education.



That is, I think most of you would probably agree if you,



especially if you've been to more than one church, it tends



to be somewhat different than the, um,



faith development writ large



that you might say happen in the rest of the church.



Unless you already have a lot of integration



with your religious education professional



or the religious education project of of your church.



I wanted to talk with religious educators,



which I've done over the last year, to name



what they think are the most important



and unique practices, the sacred powerful practices



that we know a lot about and that we do all the time.



Because I was wondering how we might be able to



serve our congregations better, particularly our adults



who are so often stuck in a higher conflict,



lower faith development capacity, lower ability



to be covenantal, lower ability to be really



functional pieces of a community that is a congregation,



and to move into leadership to serve meaningfully



and faithfully in alignment with our theological, um,



our theological principles and values.



Values. So can you move to the next slide, please?



Talking with DREs, religious educators,



religious education professionals,



about this question was so much fun.



Um, and I've distilled the things



that they said here down a bit.



We bring the fun, we lead with curiosity and wondering.



The main point is community.



We're great at process and connections.



We're good at accompanying and supporting.



We naturally use storytelling, song



and movement, joy and play.



Accessibility and inclusion are natural parts of our work.



In learning community and worship,



we're embodied and experiential.



We decenter the written word as our primary pedagogy.



We plan with developmental and neurodivergent awareness.



We model an imperfect reality that is humanizing



and liberating and we're great at meaning making all our



work is grounded in theology and values.



What was so fun about talking



with religious education professionals about this is



so many adults who are not part of the RE community.



Well, more often than you would think, talk about how



engaging in church culture, in ways



that are family friendly



or child friendly are dumbing it down.



I'm sure none of you would ever say



or think anything like that.



However, as a longtime religious educator, this,



this last month, it, it was my 16th year,



but most of it's been in congregations small and large.



I heard that so many times



and yet my experience, I heard that from, you know,



if it was gonna be a multi-generational worship service



and we're gonna do something



that was gonna have children and families present.



My experience though as a religious educator was



that I was working with colleagues who were highly skilled,



who really understood what they were doing as sacred



and who thought about it in a very conceptual, elevated,



amazing way, and we're smart enough



to create developmental scaffolding and supports



and layers so that at the time for all ages was for children



as much as it was for adults and vice versa, et cetera.



I wanted to understand better



how we might take these fantastic minds



and hearts of religious education professionals



and this work that has been happening in the basements



and in the, in the RE wings



and in the youth group room,



and really gathered up it up,



illuminate the value in it



that moves us closer to our theological values.



And imagine how we might bring it to the whole church



and how that might serve all of us, every single one of us,



particularly in a time when we have fewer volunteers than



ever. Parents who are the normal volunteers, really don't,



don't have the energy they need to be served.



They need to pray, they need to cry, they need, um,



and if they want to volunteer, of course they can.



But we just don't have the same culture we used to have



and we have families coming a lot more,



a lot more infrequently, which changes things about



how we do re as well.



And at a time where so many churches are getting squeezed



and are in turn squeezing their staff



to do more with less.



I think this is a really elegant



and integrative solution



that doesn't cut corners so much as it does



share an abundant capacity for religious education.



Next slide please.



So what are these things



that make up these magical practices of religious education



and how might we turn them into something we think of more



as Whole Church RE, in ways that benefit all of us?



You can see here at the roots of the tree, I named some



of those specific things, the not



elevated high concept language that the DREs used on



that last slide, but I asked them



specific things that they do.



Let me make this a little bit bigger



for myself to read here.



Ah, yeah. Um, so they said things like, you know,



we use story and wondering and arts and crafts and music



and movement and ritual and ceremony and welcome



and belonging and celebration and play and connection.



And I thought this is really the answer.



We can bring these things into different locations,



different times and in different communities



of our community of the church in ways that, um,



succeed at the project of religious education, bring it



to more of our adults in ways that serve our families more,



um, fully reflective of their needs, um,



and in ways that strengthen our



cultural perpetuity in ways that make our children



remember this church.



Not just the RE wing, in ways that help our adults



look forward to coming on Sunday, in part



because they haven't seen their own grandchildren in a



year or since



COVID. And that help all of us



not just get better faith developed,



but become more human together.



Which any developmental model that tells you



that humans change and transform



and grow alone is a model



that was dreamed up by a computer.



We know how much we need each other.



We know how much we have to learn from each other.



We know how it feels when a church is alive.



Next slide, please.



So I asked a graphic artist who happened also



to be a religious educator, um,



or was unfortunately that, that that position was cut.



That's too, too common a story just now, right?



But we lifted up the work that she was so good at to name



some of the things that Whole Church RE can do



that bring those amazing, powerful,



sacred religious education practices as a blessing



and an offering to the whole church in ways



that can transform and connect us all.



And this is what we came up with as we thought long



and hard together from the LFE team,



but also on Congregational Life.



We thought about how the things that we do



and can do better in, uh, mixed, uh,



community, different locations,



different times include things like telling our sacred



stories that can both be storytelling,



but also that's our rituals, our coming



of age service, our bridging.



That's faithful conversations.



Adults learning better, how



to actually be in faithful conversation with each other,



turning to each other, connecting better,



especially in times of conflict.



So there's some deep health stuff here.



Creative contemplation, the ways that alone



and together we can engage in contemplative practices



that make us all healthier, better able to deal with stress,



the world burning, et cetera.



Community making meaning both how we make our community



and how we would do making in community.



An example of this is RE Makerspace



for all ages, for example.



But it also has to do with the ways that we bond



to build beloved community.



Like, uh, things that we could do in Coffee Hour together,



for example, or after church or at some different events.



The ways that we really are just connecting,



because we want this community to be strong



because we know it's the glue for everything else



that is faithful public witness.



How we show up, um, how we do it in ways



that are developmentally appropriate.



How we could bring our public witness work to our children,



and how our children could help inform the ways



that we do our public witness work.



And finally, joyful connections.



I don't wanna downplay the importance of joy and play



and rest and authenticity.



Um, it especially in moments where, uh,



the work is hard and very real.



Um, when church can be a place of joyful connection,



that's when you're going to see everyone wanting to come,



come more, support it more, get involved in that group



and that covenant circle, et cetera.



Next slide please.



So this one's a little overwhelming.



I'm gonna ask Chanel to drop the links, all



of the links into our chat at this time.



This is a graphic that's really meant



for our religious educators to fill in on their own.



It's an adaptable template



and you'll, you can find it if you wish to look at it in,



uh, one of the links there, which is the Call



and Response, Whole Church RE blog.



There's several, several, uh,



articles here that you can look at.



But that blog post has a big explanation



of Whole Church RE,



more in depth than I've gone into here today.



And it includes an adaptable template that includes this,



um, this graphic.



If we're centered in love



and growing in faith, if our values are compelling



and orienting us to our work.



If these green



and blue post-it notes can name some of the, um,



some of the, um, oh my gosh,



what are they even called in congregation, some



of our congregational committees and action groups



and our aims of faith development like pastoral care



and beloved community and,



and identity formation and justice making.



If we can work with those parts of our church's,



culture and communities



and for those aims in ways that are realistic,



that are fairly easy to do and that make everyone feel good



and really work with the amount of resources that we have



in different times, places,



and with different folks than we have in the past,



then we can do really cool things.



Like, for example, if you're looking for an opportunity



to do great interdependent learning



with a multi-gen experience, you could,



like on the left bottom corner of this, of this graphic,



you could use the Collaborative Art Mosaics at any event.



So you can see here that you could start to plug in



or your religious educator



or council could begin to plug in what you might do,



how you might do it in ways that look a little different.



More like Whole Church RE. Soon Congregational Life



and LFE have joined forces,



and soon we will have the debut of the Congregational Guide



to Shared Values Learning with Whole Church RE Approaches,



which will be a little bit like plug and play.



Try this out over the next year in different ways, uh,



in a scripted, concise way that will help people be able



to try some of these things out.



Like for example, using the idea



of identity formation



and living faith to do sidewalk chalk



theology outside your church.



If you live in an area where you'd really like



for the neighborhood to know



and it's safe to do so, about



how our theology informs our values.



Um, the idea that you can do RE that day



after church with folks helping each other.



One of the most heartwarming things is seeing children help



elders in this moment, for example,



to write out the thoughts of



what they think being a UU means to them



and what they'd like for the neighborhood



or the community to know about it.



Um, we'll be lifting up the wonderful work



that went into these sidewalk chalk theology



efforts, also called Neighborhood Love notes.



We did this in 2016, uh,



and now it's time to lift up what we've done



and give people more opportunities to do it.



That's just an example of one of the ways



that we can connect more deeply,



more transformatively, more joyfully.



Um, and it doesn't change everything about church.



But when we start to try some of these things



and we start to see the impact, we recognize



that we are doing a better job



of integrating our community at all levels.



Um, it does sound really cool. It is really cool.



I did it at my church at that time.



And there's it, the reason it is



because it gives the flavor of the kind of cool,



a bit subversive, different fun way to do some of the things



that are still very meaningful, identity formation,



theologically grounded stuff.



But what would it look like if we brought more



adults into that?



And what would it look like if our children saw



how deeply important it is to our adults



that we're all co-learning?



So I could go on and on about this.



This is pretty much the only sermon I've been preaching



for the last 16 years since I started this work.



Um, but let's go to the final slide.



Draw your attention to kind of where we started here



with our core values, encouraging us



to help each other survive



and thrive, to help everyone flourish,



to share generously and joyfully, to embrace



and celebrate diversity, to change



and grow together, to build beloved community.



I can't think of a better way for religious education



to join forces with this key core learning we've all been



called to do right now.



Um, and I believe that this is a way that we can do



that to together.



I will say that we should, um,



you could stop sharing the slides.



Thank you. You can look for us to have, uh, some modeling



of Whole Church RE at GA this year.



So look for us in the main hall



and we'll be setting up a space where families



and children and youth



and people of all ages, including y'all, can come by,



observe, pick up some of the hand work



and the other activities



that we're gonna have available there.



Get involved, take part in the collaborative mosaic



of our shared values.



We have so much cool stuff and when people see it



and experience it and take home a little thing about it



or scan your QR code



or whatever, we think that you are going to want



to try out some of these things at your church as well.



But most of all, I think we'd all just love to see



an example of how we, one



of the last multi-generational spaces in Western culture,



at least in America, can still play a role



in creating the kind of community that strengthens hearts



to do the deep transformative work



of building beloved community within, among



and beyond our congregational walls.



Thank you so much for giving me the opportunity



to share some of this with you tonight.



I, um, can be found talking about this



everywhere all the time.



So if you have more questions,



I would love to talk with you.



Um, and with that, I'm gonna turn it back to Lauren.



Yeah, well there will be more talking tonight.



So we have come to the right place for that joy.



I just, I just so, um, enlivened



by your passion every time I get to hear you speak



or be in conversation with you, um, it is, it is, um,



a transformative, um, uh, process that you're describing



that I, that I am, uh, grateful



that you are helping us imagine together.



So, well, I hope that you had some good conversation



in your breakout groups.



Um, if you would like for Joy,



before I even ask what questions you might have come up



with, if you would like for Joy to know something that, um,



you learned, something that joy shared



that deepened your understanding of faith development,



you're answered round one.



Feel free to drop that into the chat right now.



And as you do, I'm gonna kind



of prime the, prime the pump with first question, um,



which I have been holding for joy, which is,



which I think you kind of answered one,



but I'm gonna ask you to give us another example.



'cause I love examples, Joy.



I talk to so many congregations who are, uh, you know,



have familiar patterns about how they do



most things in church life.



And, and yet they're interested in the idea



of trying out some Whole Church ways of being together.



And they wanna know like, what's a good starting point?



And I know it's different for every congregation



and I know there's no one right answer and all of that,



but you are somebody who has heard from a lot of people



who are trying out, making small bets, you know,



trying out Whole Church in their congregations.



What's, what's another, what's an example other than the



sidewalk chalk, which I think actually is a, another



a a great example of what's an, another example



of a Whole Church, um, activity



that somebody could try out easily low stakes.



I love that. And I think some of these graphics that, um,



that, that our graphic designer DRE made for us



get a little bit deeper into helping you actually have a way



to think about this with three or four



or five people if you're trying to plan something.



But that said, um, thinking about the location



or the time or the people with whom you'd like



to do something is key.



Mm-hmm. And I'll just,



we'll just pretend we're throwing a pair of dice here



and coming up with, I'd like to do something around justice



with the Whole Church, during sort



of regular church writ large.



Mm-hmm. Um, and I think about, you know, so you can,



you can, you can, you can, uh, you can roll the dice



and get any three location, um, focus and community.



Um, and I just, there's so many things



that you can do at coffee hour.



We talked about sidewalk chalk theology happening



after church or before church, but mm-hmm.



Um, so many times when I'm talking about Whole Church area,



what I really wanna get across is look for



where there is already energy.



There may be energy in a place,



there may be energy at a time,



and there may be energy with a certain group of people.



So maybe your justice committee is hoping



to attract more families or young adults



or whatever youth into its work.



And it's mostly older folks



and they're having trouble, you know, making



that whatever invitation in a welcoming, exciting way,



working with your social justice committee



to do something cool but small at coffee hour.



Like the collaborative art mosaics



for the shared values are so amazing.



Each person colors a tiny square on their own,



but then you put 'em up together



and you've got a big display working on a community weaving



project where you pick up a ribbon,



you write something on it, like your hope



for the church this year, or your hope for the world.



And then you've got it set up on a table in the side



of the room where we have one person who's able



to help guide actually weaving them together.



And you can also talk about covenant next time you are in



the pulpit or whatever.



And, and draw back to that about



how we tie ourselves together.



Deep talk blocks are another really great example of, uh,



a very small thing you can do anytime you've got people



sitting down at a table together so



that you move people into this language



of reverence like Bill Siford



and, um, uh, Jean Nieuwejaar, described in Fluent in Faith.



We have a lot of resources that can help you think about



the kind of thing you'd like to do,



but I think the main key thing is where is some energy



that you'd like to work with



to bring a religious education experience for all



Amazing, amazing joy.



I just love how you just pull these right outta the air.



All these examples. Uh, one of the questions



that's in the chat from Mary Sheldon,



Mary Sheldon's group is what are some ideas for how



to incorporate Whole Church faith formation into worship?



Mm-hmm. Find that, and I,



and I think some of what you just said actually could be



part of worship, but what would,



So again, yeah, I would just start



to constellate location is worship.



What is it I'm wanting to do?



I'm wanting to just have more, um,



connected religious education experience there.



Um, you know, one thing you can do is



look into the, the soul work.



A a big resource that I've created over several years



that gives people hand work to do, um, in service.



And it's for people of all ages.



And it has the same effect on the brain.



Neuroscience tells us, um, as meditation.



So it's calming for the body. It helps one focus.



It also promotes comprehension and recall.



So when people talk about fidget items,



they think about it like, oh, we just need



to keep the kids quiet and, you know, keep 'em busy.



But actually there are these contemplative practices



that we can easily package up,



bring right into the worship service offer



for people of all ages.



Put your name on it, you can finish it next Sunday.



And that makes you wanna come back if you're a kid.



Um, that can really help support us in that space.



So that's an example of how we explode the idea that



materials that are tactile



or, you know, crafty are just for kids.



And we support people of all ages in a way that you look



around and you realize, oh, making,



doing contemplative work process, hand work,



this is part of who we are as a people. That changes us.



I think of the knitters and our pews.



There are knitters in many of our pews, aren't they? Yeah.



And that's what they're doing, isn't it?



Uh, here's a question that I hear often from Heather



Joey, how do we prepare the adult members



of our congregation for a Whole Church model



that welcomes people with diverse behaviors, particularly



a large population of autistic children?



And I wanna ask, I wonder



where the autistic adults are in this congregation



or what, where, where they have gone.



But what's your response to this question?



How do we prepare the other members of the congregation?



Remember that we have three ways to,



to teach Unitarian Universalism.



I bet you good students out there, remember



that there's the explicit curriculum.



So we could, we could attack that head on.



There's the implicit curriculum.



We could act and model in ways that help a,



a learning develop, but not mention it specifically.



Or we could have a null curriculum, which is



that we just don't talk about all the adults that have some



of the same behaviors, but that are masking a lot



or that, um, have,



have somehow been grandfathered in, let's say.



Um, so I think one of the most important things we can do is



by showing up in ways that are truly inclusive.



It's subverts very much the idea that it's a problem



when we talk about with our explicit curriculum, is around



how we strive to be welcoming and inclusive



and let people bring in their authentic whole selves



to our community.



And that we are all better for it.



That we all are more human from that.



It changes, um, how we think in the moment when there is



the cry of a baby, which of course means



that our church is growing



or some of the behaviors that adults have.



I was thinking about Jen,



Jen Nichols down in SWAC in Texas when I first started,



who heard these concerns?



Holter Cherry had a, a good foothold there long time ago,



uh, in Denton, Texas and other, other churches there.



Um, and she took a recording



after hearing these complaints, she took a recording.



She asked everybody to, it was like a meditation.



She set it up and she recorded



how many noises were made in a whole church,



multi-generational setting in the sanctuary.



And then she played it back, and then she talked about it



and it was so much more adult noise.



You know what I mean? So there's this way in which



actually we're highly activated



and stimulated by children, in part



because we don't have mm-hmm.



We don't use those muscles, those wrought faith muscles.



The times that we are together,



we lean into it pretty quickly.



And if there's good attention and accompanying



and pastoral care for the feelings, the anxiety,



the frustration that this kind



of change brings while firmly aligning it



with our vision about our values



and our principles, especially with a minister



using their power and authority to name



and claim religious education for all as the central mission



or a central core mission of our church.



We can move through this, but we wanna make sure



we support y'all in this.



Just setting you up to like do it



and then having to deal with the frustration



of some powerful, um, big donating



members is frankly where the rubber hits the road.



So, um, we wanna make sure that we have multiple things,



resources, but also support. Congregational Life is a good



place to have conversations about some of these things too,



if things are coming up in your congregation,



but we don't want you to go in empty handed.



Yeah. Well, and this is being recorded.



There's a reason we're having this conversation



with congregational leaders.



The more we're inviting one another into this con into this



conversation before we get to the sanctuary,



and then we're hearing from the pulpit some



of these messages we're being reminded of, oh,



isn't it beautiful that we're hearing all the



noises of all generations?



Then we start to have a shared language around it.



I really appreciate that joy. Thank you.



Uh, we, this time is flying by, so I'm gonna,



I have two questions.



One of them anonymous. I'll use that as our last one.



But here's our second to last. Um, from Jennifer.



I was wondering how this model could save volunteer hours.



I know you mentioned it earlier,



but I don't see how it could,



unless we're cutting the individual classes,



I'm worried this might be more work



for my volunteers instead of less.



So we wanna make sure we say something very clearly here.



Sounds like you are in a system



where your classes are working well.



You've got enough volunteers for the class sizes



and the number of classes that you wanna offer,



or for the number of services that you offer.



At my last church, we needed to get to a place



where we visioned together about the need for Whole Church,



and I mean the whole congregation vision together, along



with me and the minister, we got to the point



where we realized we needed 58, uh, volunteers per service,



and that was 126 total



or whatever the numbers were, something like that.



And they didn't all have to be on, on a Sunday,



but those were the sizes of the teams we needed



to make that class work.



We needed three teachers per in a big church.



And then we looked at the breakdown of



how many parents versus how many non-parents volunteer.



And it really helped my congregation to see how we had a,



um, we had this almost like a underclass of parents



that were doing all of this work



and they, we didn't reall.



engage with how much just kilocalories



it required, spiritual kilocalories are required.



So what I wanna say about this is that, uh,



if classes are working for you,



if you're not feeling squeezed about that,



if your DRE is is feeling like it's awesome, great, um,



or in a lay leadership, whatever, um,



but when we start to think about how we could do some



of our RE in different ways, it might mean



that one Sunday a month



or two Sundays a month, that we have a different approach.



On this Sunday, for example, we're going



to be opening up our a, b



and c RE spaces, normal, regular classes, spaces, whatever,



to adults to join in.



Mm-hmm. On this Sunday, we're going



to be doing some justice public witness stuff in



and outside of the church at coffee hour and on the grounds



and sidewalking, um, instead of,



so it might be a justice RE approach.



Mm-hmm. So we don't have to shift from having



to having no classes or to having no classes whatsoever.



But starting to think about specifically about volunteers,



let me say to bring this home.



If you are doing a shared group experience wherein parents



are present, your church policy for RE probably is



that parents have supervision



of their children at certain times in certain



places, et cetera.



So, you know, an ending to the RE class time,



turning the children over to their parents,



and then you're having a supervised experience.



What that does is that the total number of folks



who are needed to actually shepherd for not just safety,



but quality in a coffee hour experience



or outside, goes way, way, way, way down.



And you're in a public space wherein all supervision is not



required for from the religious educator.



And that really opens us up to bring the magic of,



of the practice, um, in real ways in community.



And the reality is, if parents are going to be in charge



of their kids anyway, most



of them would rather do it in a group setting than having



to actually lead a class when it does come down



to a stressor type situation, which you may not have.



The final question, and we really have just one minute



for this one, which is not time to do it justice.



But what does this mean about



how we fund our religious educators?



If we're doing together, do we still need DREs?



Do they need more hours, less hours?



How does this interact? Short answer. Well,



I wanna just draw your attention back to



that slide wherein when you get the DREs talking,



what they say they do is some pretty awesome



high level stuff.



And it's true. If your church is able to



make a religious education program happen in any way without



a religious education professional, go for it.



If you're growing and families are



happy, then you're doing something right.



You are doing religious education ministry.



But to do this well, we really do need to have preparation,



support, um,



and religious education professionals need to be,



have their leadership and their vision cultivated.



And I see nothing here that takes, um, less time



or energy from a religious educator.



Because remember, in most of these cases,



we're going from serving just the children



and youth here to how would we actually develop the faith



of this entire congregation



and connect people who are not connected?



So in some ways you're adding things,



but, um, what we don't wanna do is stack,



we want your religious educator to feel comfortable that



they are trying something new



and they might be able to lean out on something else



and moving in that direction to see what works for you



and what your community really thrives



and has a lot of energy for.



Hmm. What I hear you talking about too is syncing up the



efforts of your staff, your ministry,



your religious educator, whatever staff you might have so



that you're all thinking together. Yes.



So, yeah, that's an important thing is



that these approaches naturally lend themselves



to shared ministry work.



So bringing in your minister and your music person



and your membership person, um, in these shared experiences,



locations, times is much more, um, natural and integrated.



Beautiful. Joy, I love,



I love having you here with us.



Thank you so much for all of this goodness



that you've shared with us.



I know it's gonna go back out into congregations



and into conversations



and there are gonna be seeds planted all over our region.



I'm so grateful for that.